I can count those making a cogent argument against moving to Stratford on one hand.
Martin Cloake’s thoughts make for thoughtful and well balanced reading. Little surprise from an author, editor and journalist who is amongst those most well placed to pass comment.
Martin ran this yesterday on his blog.
What I’d like to do is take his piece and look at it in across a few blogs. Here’s Part One….
I’ll confess my initial reaction to the ‘Spurs to Stratford’ rumours was to see it as a negotiating position. I knew Spurs were having problems with Haringey Council and, as someone who grew up in Haringey and started my working life as an employee I’m very familiar with Haringey’s ability to make a royal mess of almost everything it touches.
The Tottenham On My Mind blog has, in a well-argued piece, been critical of the “ambivalence” of many fans who took the same position. I’ll hold my hands up and it say it looks like – and only looks like – my initial reaction was wrong and that Spurs do intend to move to Stratford. But I still think many of the issues are much more complex than inevitably tends to be the case when a public debate such as this one is sparked.
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So what follows are some thoughts and questions on the while issue. And I’ll start from where I start. I want Spurs to stay in Tottenham. That’s where the club was formed, that’s where it’s always been, and that’s where its unique and extraordinary history has been forged.
The new stadium envisioned in the Northumberland Development Project looks mighty fine and it has the huge advantage of being as close to the current site as it’s possible to get. I know most of us who go to Spurs no longer live in the area. And I think there’s a lot of baloney talked about ‘community’. I’m not sure how many of the local residents like their area being invaded every other weekend and midweek night.
But English football is a complex beast, that’s why it is such a big deal. A sense of place is key to that. We are Tottenham, from the Lane is a popular song with the fans. And I’ve heard many a fan say, “The area’s a sh*ithole. But it’s our sh*thole.”
We have roots in N17 and that is just one of things that gives us the high ground over that other lot who relocated from Woolwich.
I don’t like the sound of Stratford Wanderers at all. It matters to me that watch the team from the same ground I began watching the team from in 1978, the same ground on which we won the UEFA Cup in 1984, the same ground on which we established the tradition of the glory glory European nights.
You can’t put a monetary value on that which is why the multimillionaire owners of football clubs don’t get it. Although of course, they are happy to take the monetary value we put on in in the shape of ticket prices and merchandise, the demand for which is all fueled in part by that very tradition they see as having less value than we place on it.
The club maintains it is keeping its options open. But the appointment of Mike Lee, the regular drip of stories about the ‘cost’ of redeveloping White Hart Lane and yesterday’s statement by the architect the club has employed that Stratford was the preferred option indicate that otherwise. It looks very much like the club is waiting for opinion to soften or until such time as it can say it was forced to move to Stratford. because it’s clear that at the moment the majority feeling is against the move.
There’s one key thing that needs clearing up. Exactly what, and how much, are the ‘extra’ costs of redeveloping our current home? The message coming from the club is that various public bodies are asking for too much in the form of funding improvements to the area.
They are, in fact, tagging on to the club’s plans in order get funding from the club for an area that has been left to rot for the best part of 30 years. In a club statement on 19 November, much was made of the fact that Wembley and the Emirates secured public funding, while Spurs are being asked to fund the public.
I’m not unsympathetic to that argument. Having known the area for so long it is, at best, amusing to see so many people suddenly so passionate about regenerating it after so many years when it did not register. Unless there was a riot.
But there is now a recession on, in contrast to the periods which saw Wembley and the Emirates built. And it seems to be very difficult to get a straight answer about those extra costs. It’s been put to me that it’s not just the section 106 stuff, but the cost of building a major modern stadium in the tight physical confines of Tottenham as opposed to Stratford.
There’s no reason to disbelieve that. But those costs are the same as they would always have been. They are what they are. They have not suddenly become ‘extra’. They may be more expensive than the subsequent option that has emerged. That option may be cheaper. But the argument about ‘extra’ costs does not currently stand up.
Of course, not meeting extra costs plays better with the fans than opting for cheaper. So, not for the first time it must be said, what may be an attempt to spin by Spurs has prompted suspicion rather than gathered support. 
AY ARRY WHY YOU DELETE MY MSG BLUDCLAART – SUCK YOUR MUDA
hello tinky winky
BUN DIS WEBSITE FAM ALL MI SAY IS ME NAH GO TO STRATFORD CHEIF INA DELETE MI MSG TI RASSCLART
:hae:
are you married to Bert?
you is azza blud in disguise!
Right up front I will say that I would much rather stay in Tottenham and have the fantastic stadium that is planned built on the earmarked site. I’m sure that the vast majority of Spurs fans would also prefer this option.
Martin Cloake’s article is the first that I have seen that offers some sort of balance to the stadium issue. There are a myriad of scare stories doing the rounds at the moment, e.g. the utter bollocks about changing the name. Unfortunately, there is nothing coming out from the club to counteract these stories.
I wont even comment on the cost difference beween rebuilding WHL & Stratford as it is a no brainer.
We are all aware of the issues surrounding transport. I live on the south coast and when I visit the Lane, which is normally 6 – 8 times a season, I either travel by car or use the railways. The car journey is fine until I hit Telford Lane on the north circular. After the match, it takes just as long to get to that same point (about 5 miles from WHL), than it does to do the other 80 miles. The train is fine on a Saturday or Sunday, but midweek is a problem as it takes about 3 hours to get home. I don’t know what can be done about this issue, apart from all traffic lights away from WHL to the A406 should be on green for much longer. What I don’t understand is the reluctance of Transport For London (TFL) to help many of us with tube travel. We are all aware of the 20 minutes walk to Seven Sisters tube station, then the problems getting onto the platform, let alone getting onto the train. Why cant TFL help by using the tube depot at Northumberland Park as a temporary station on matchdays only? It’s only a few minutes walk from the ground and would help to relieve some of the issues. I can’t see that travelling to Stratford by car would be any easier for anyone, but certainly for anyone travelling but by train or tube, it will be a massive improvement.
I applaud the voice of protest groups such as We Are N17, but when you view their website, there is no balanced argument. They just say they are opposed to the move.
I would also ask where David Lammy MP has been for the past 3 years. Has he been working on the clubs behalf to try to address some of the issues surrounding a rebuild at WHL? I’d never heard of the bloke until Stratford was first mentioned. Maybe someone who lives in the constituency could enlighten me. But his comments about trying to prevent Spurs using Tottenham in the name if we move are abject and pathetic. Will he be stopping Tottenham residents from working on a rebuild of the Olympic Stadium, or taking a job at the stadium or surrounding area?
Also, the shock horror story that we would be knocking down the OS. West Ham will be dismantling & rebuilding about 70% of it too. Did you know that there are no toilets inside the OS? They are all located in temporary buildings outside. The OS was designed as a temporary building, to be used for a short period of time. Why is that not reported in the news?
I’m going to stop typing now, as the more I write, the more I’m convincing myself that the move to Statford is what I want. It’s not. I want a balanced reporting in the media, so we can make an informed decision about what is best for this great club of ours.
brilliant piece FF
I fall into the same boat; south coast and about the same games. Maybe we arent best to make comment and it affects us ‘less’ proportionately
However; if i am to be a little selfish just for a minute then Stratford would make it so much easier
My hearts still in WHL thou and I hate this feeling of being torn between heart and head
where on the south coast – me too
Chandlers Ford for me.
ooh, down there. That is a distance. I’m near Lewes
Near Falmer & Hove Albion? :cool:
further south still boys !!!! :pirat: :pirat: :pirat: :pirat:
Bournemouth riviera
Perhaps if you all car-shared then the travelling to WHL issue would be no longer!
The problem from start to finish is Haringey Council and their general anbivalence towards any redevelopment of WHL. All this sudden concern about what a move away from WHL would do to the local community. I have been watching Spurs since 1967 and Tottenham has been in decline ever since that time. What have the politicians been doing in all that time to stop the decline and assist the area? NOT MUCH is the answer. This point is well made in the Martin Cloake article. Like most Spurs supporters I would prefer to stay at WHL BUT the bottom line is we cannot do NOTHING, we have to get a bigger stadium or be satisfied with mid table and the odd cup run . It looks like getting a bigger stadium at WHL will just be too expensive unless we get some support from local and central government which is even more unlikely in the current climate than ever. Sadly Stratford could be the only game in town for us and for Stratford we likewise could be the only game in town for the Olympic site. Really wish we did not have to move BUT it looks more likely with every passing day. I did wonder why we have not suggested building the new athletics stadium at WHL. As a compromise that would keep WHL as a good say 30000 venue, keep the Tottenham area alive, give a decent Athletics venue and NOT add too much stress to the transport and infrastructure in and around the Tottenham area. Effectively we just swap venue with the Olympic stadium, albeit we still have to rebuild that stadium and refurb WHL a bit. Food for thought.
i’m fed up with the n17 movement shooting everyone down for considering the prospect of moving to the olympic site. very few fans prefer the idea of moving to the olympic site, but there is a difference between what we wish for and what is realistically the best option for the club, and therefore us the fans. i’d love to stay in N17 and move to a new ground and for it’s name to remain as white hart lane.
but even staying in tottenham, the stadium will not be called white hart lane, so instantly we will be losing history, it won’t be the same stadium, or even in the same position, there will be an ice rink where the corner flag currently is.
Finally a good article, please write more like this, it was a good read, without all the usual writing in riddles.
Whereas we’re all still waiting a comment from you worth reading.
that reminds. It must be time for a cryptic crossword line up photo thingy